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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted -  14/11/2010  :  06:41
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Stanley Challenger Graham




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stanley at barnoldswick.freeserve.co.uk
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Julie in Norfolk
Senior Member


1632 Posts
Posted - 01/12/2011 : 16:39
knickers for the learned?- Profundities


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belle
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6502 Posts
Posted - 01/12/2011 : 22:47
Songs in favour of fun?


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Julie in Norfolk
Senior Member


1632 Posts
Posted - 02/12/2011 : 04:12
tee hee


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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 02/12/2011 : 04:56
All very clever but look at my post of 27/11. It was another archaic word for David to use.


Stanley Challenger Graham




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tripps
Senior Member


1404 Posts
Posted - 02/12/2011 : 12:36
Not one of my favourite words - de profundis clamavi   etc reminds me of funerals.
I still enjoy 'tergiversate' though for the life of me I can't remember how to spell it, and have to look it up. I get the G and the V confused. I have learned that besides changing sides, it also means "to use evasion or ambiguities; to equivovate in order to mislead, or withold information"  - perfect for politicians.

My current favourite is Gallithumpian, which I found in a book by the Failsworth poet Ben Brierley. A copy has just arrived this morning, published in 1884, and it's wonderful.  I first met the  in the Victorian poetry site which Thomo recommended, but a google shows no results. It will in a day or two after this mention.  I thought of putting it in response to the religion question in the 2011 Census, but bottled out.
He mentions fishing for 'Jack Sharps'  which is a name I vaguely remember - also known as tiddlers.   I think I'm rambling now  - time for the tablets.....

PS  Found it on google - just needed a bit more effort to persuade it that the word existed.

Edited by - tripps on 02/12/2011 7:39:30 PM


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Tizer
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5150 Posts
Posted - 03/12/2011 : 11:07
We saw someone walking down the lane with a big black dog this morning, like a black bear, and I wondered what it was. Mrs Tiz said "Louise has the same make of dog".


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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 04/12/2011 : 04:38
Sounds like a Newfoundland! Janet is quite possibly correct in her usage, there are so many designer breeds about nowadays, basically mongrels being sold at inflated prices. The world of dog-breeding for profit is a murky place!


Stanley Challenger Graham




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tripps
Senior Member


1404 Posts
Posted - 07/12/2011 : 14:45
Talking of dogs - remember we discussed skenning and whelps etc - well here's a quote from the book I mentioned above (1884). It's in strong dialect, but worth quoting.....

"or else i' twenty-four hours fro' now thy face'll be covered wi' wrinkles, thy nose'll turn up like a pump-stang, thy yure 'll be as grey as thy gronny's, and thou'll sken wur nor a wisket full o' new-pupt whelps."


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Tizer
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5150 Posts
Posted - 07/12/2011 : 20:03
Is a new-pupt whelp the same as a new-whelped pup, I wonder?


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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 08/12/2011 : 05:29
I've always understood that quotation as "Skenning like a basket of Whelks" They look like eyes and of course point in all directions.


Stanley Challenger Graham




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tripps
Senior Member


1404 Posts
Posted - 08/12/2011 : 21:07
Have I persuaded you to revise your understanding?  Pretty strong unambiguous citation, and try as I might, I can't visualise a skenning whelk. Smile


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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 09/12/2011 : 03:26
Sorry to be difficult but on the whole no. Brewer and Morris have no mention so I went to the web and found several confirmations of my version and a couple of quotations to support the whelks. So, until someone comes up with an irefutable authority I'll stick with the whelks. Sorry David......


Stanley Challenger Graham




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panbiker
Senior Member


2300 Posts
Posted - 09/12/2011 : 09:30


quote:
tripps wrote:
Have I persuaded you to revise your understanding?  Pretty strong unambiguous citation, and try as I might, I can't visualise a skenning whelk. Smile

You need a basket full!

The basket of whelks version is all I have ever heard also. Not used a lot but a clear recall for me.


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Tizer
VIP Member


5150 Posts
Posted - 09/12/2011 : 15:21
I suppose we talk about skenning like a whelk because molluscs such as whelks have their eyes on stems (think of snails) and can point them in all directions - and round corners. There is more than you want to know about whelks on this web site: [LINK]


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tripps
Senior Member


1404 Posts
Posted - 09/12/2011 : 16:29
I was going to give up now, but Ill have one last go.  I'm talking English language usage her not marine biology, but I found on the fascinating whelk site that
"Strombids have well-developed eyes, with visible "eyeballs" on the ends of stalks. No whelk has an eye that looks remotely like this. All whelk eyespots are small back dots ". It also emerges that I have a  large  orange one in my bathroom as an ornament! I know a lot more about it now.Smile

I think this site explains what I am trying  to say.  I know you have all heard the whelk version, but I would say it has derived from the whelp version a long time ago.  Just because many preople use an expression doesn't make it right.  For example look at "begs the question" - almost universally used wrongly, and  by many people who should know better. 
I love these words - I saw and advert on Gumtree recently - someone trying to sell a "chester draws",  and I've heard a BBC R5  presenter say "tarnished with the same brush". I think I'll start a collection.

SCG - genuine question - what would constitute "an irrefutable authority" ?






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