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Doc
Keeper of the Scrolls


2010 Posts
Posted -  20/04/2004  :  01:29
I found this interesting article which sheds new light on the Lancashire Witches trial at Lancaster. In it, it mentions "Malkin Tower" at Blacko, but I am sure I have read somewhere that this (Current) Malkin Tower is not the original one mentioned. Anyway here's the article.

The Clerk of the Assizes Court at Lancaster was Thomas Potts and he left a full account of the proceedings. These reveal that Alison Device and Anne Redfern, the daughters of Mothers Demdike and Chattox, were also committed along with their mothers.


Potts then relates that the four women had not been in Lancaster Castle more than a week, "....when their children and friends being abroad at liberties, laboured a special meeting at Malkin Tower in the Forest of Pendle, upon a good-fryday within a week after they were committed, of all the most dangerous, wicked and damnable witches in the country, far and near. Upon a good-fryday they met, according to solemn appointment, solemnised this great festival day according to their former order, with great cheer, merry company and much conference. In the end, in their great assemble it was decreed that M.Covell (the gaoler at Lancaster Castle) by reason of his office shall be slain before the next Assizes, the Castle at Lancaster to be blown up."


The evidence of the Malkin Tower meeting and its outcome having taken place, was based solely on the words of, Jennet Device, the granddaughter of Mother Demdike and she was then only nine years of age.


Malkin Towers was allegedly the home of Old Demdike and this is located on the Ordnace Survey Map Number 41 of the Outdoor Leaisue series at Map Reference 867422 just east of Blacko Hill and just over threequarters of a mile east of Lower Aedmergill.


Intensive research via the 1:50000 scale maps of Britain between the Glasgow - Edinburgh line and the south coast of England, show that the place-name, "Aedmer", only occurs just north of Blacko village. Namely, Lower Aedmergill, Aedmergill Water and Higher Aedmer 500 yards north of them. In fact, the top of Blacko Hill is only 650 yards from Lower Admergill.


The significance of Old Mother Demdike alleged home being within 650 yards of a unique Aedmer place-name, is when one realise that, "Aedmer", was allegedly the founding father of Druids.


As this association has not previously been discussed, it is information not disclosed until now that may reveal a specific area of research into pre-Christian Pagan practices or offer clues as to why, "Aedmer" was considered the founder of the Druids.


So although the story of the Lancashire Witches is certainly the most intriguing of it type in Britain, the presence of Aedmer in the area would certainly take the Lancashire Witches story into orbit. Especially for those who desire to know exactly how our real down to earth ancestors behaved.


Why the 9 year old Jennet Devices decided to impart her alleged knowledge of the Malkin Tower meeting is not known. Once she did tell the tale, some of those alleged to have been at Malkin Towers on that Good Friday, were also collected together and taken to the dungeons of Lancaster Castle.


Hence, as a result of the so-called evidence of Jennet Device, Justice Nowell sent nine other members of his community to Lancaster, on the accusation of: "...the most barbarous and damnable Practices, Murthers wicked and devilish conspiracies."


Therefore, to the original four alleged witches:
Elizabeth Southern (The so-called Old Mother Demdike): Anne Whittle (The so-called Old Mother Chattox): Alison Device, daughter of Elizabeth Southern and Anne Redfern, daughter of Anne Whittle, Justice Nowell added, Elizabeth Device, yet another daughter of Old Demdike and also, James Device, the son of Elizabeth Device and grandson of Old Demdike.

Others alleged to have been involved in the Good Friday Malkin Tower meeting were, Catherine Hewitt, Isabel Robey, Margaret Pearson, Alice Nutter and Jane Bulrock and her son John Bulrock. All of them sent for tial to Lancaster.


The significant one of this group was, Alice Nutter, a lady who possessed property and an estate at Roughlee; a village just less than 2 miles from the top of Blacko Hill.

However, someone who has been described as Alice Nutter's, " bitterest enemy", was in fact, the local Justice, Roger Nowell. Roger Nowell having lost a lawsuit against Alice Nutter over land boundaries of their respective properties. A connection that has led to the belief that witchcraft was not the only reason for this trial.


Thomas Potts, Clerk of the Assizes Court said of Elizabeth Southern, Old Mother Demdike, that she was a, "...very old woman, about the age of fours score yeares and had been a witch for 50 years."

Whilst Thomas Potts said of Anne Whittle, Old Mother Chattox, that she was, "...a very old, withered, spent and decrepit creature, her sight almost gone."


The scene for British justice to operate in the 17th. century is now set. Two old women with nothing to loose, one about 80 years of age and the other almost blind and recorded as a beggar. To these they attached a wealth woman in series conflict with the local Justicewho sent her for trial. The scenario, a male dominated society with all the usual prejudices living in a period of religious and political intolerance that can usually be conjure up out of thin air even today.

Cynics will say that this is almost like today really, if your black or Asian but as all those who study British history will know, you could in the past have also been Jewish, Welsh or even white if you were not the same as the religion or politics in power.


However, although there are in fact many differences between then and now, there is one important difference, in that torture was frequently used by the Justice system to extract confessions in prisons elsewhere in Britain at that time and to believe torture did not occur at Lancaster, especially to James Device, seems naive.


However, knowing this now, did not stop people writing about the Lancashire Witches at the beginning of the 20 th. century including the comment: "James Device certainly deserved his fate, for, in addition to testifying against his mother, Elizabeth Device and his sister Alison, he was instrumental in sending three absolutely innocent women to their death (namely) Catherine Hewitt, Anne Redfern and Alice Nutter."


Elizabeth Southern (Old Mother Demdike), having already confessed to practising witchcraft at the outset on the 2nd. of April to Roger Nowell, died in prison there before the Assize Court could assemble. Whilst the description made by Thomas Potts of the appearance of James Device when he was brought into court, suggests that torture had indeed been applied to him.


We will see that confessing or not confessing would make no difference and if the 20th. century has revealed anything at all, it is that practically everyone on earth can be made to confess anything desired via torture. So much then, for the poor decrepit James Device confession. He was still hanged along with eight others including the wealthy Alice Nutter who, it was alleged, could have brought convincing proof she was 50 miles away from Malkin Towers on that fateful Good Friday but as witches could fly, even that would not save her.
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birdie
New Member


1 Posts
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 14:55

I have been told that my mum's family (Nutter) was once traced back to the Lancashire Witches. Unfortunately the person that traced it died when I was a child and all the info was lost. Having tried to trace the family back I have got no further, at this time, than my G G Grandparents Robert Nutter b 1856 and Margaret Simpson b 1853, living at Padiham. There were 2 Nutter families in the area at that time but they do not appear to be linked. Is anyone able to point me in a direction which may help me to go further back and maybe find the missing link.




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BarrowfordJohn
Regular Member


706 Posts
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 17:58

Birdie, this is a MAJOR undertaking. Many people have tried to trace Alice and Richard Nutters direct descendants. All I can suggest personally is to look at Doreen Crowther's, and others,  files at Colne library. It is thought that a daughter of the Nutters  turned up in York around 1620.

 Due to lack of heirs the family seat in Roughlee eventually went sideways to Ellis Nutter of Pendle Waterside in Reedley Hallows (Quaker Bridge) who married a Towneley. This family is possibly as close to the direct descendants of Alice and Richard as it is possible to get???  

Hope that I am proved wrong - good luck in the search.




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BDonald
Regular Member


297 Posts
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 19:28

The word 'witch' comes from the Anglo-Saxon word 'wicca' meaning 'wise one' and they were usually women who knew how to use plants for curing human
and animal ailments. This knowledge was passed down from parents to children. These people played an important part in their local community. They were mostly very poor, and lived mainly by begging, although this was against the law.

Witches were feared and hated during the Tudor and Stuart periods probably because of the mystery surrounding their secret knowledge. Witchcraft had become a criminal offence by an Act passed in 1542 in the reign of Henry VIII. Death was the penalty for murdering or hurting someone by using witchcraft. During the reign of Elizabeth I (1588-1603), over 500 people were charged with witchcraft and at least 100 were hanged.

Most of the ordinary, uneducated people, living in country areas must have been very confused by the changes that took place in religion during the reign of the Tudors.

Everyone had to go to church. What must they have thought when they heard that the Abbot of Whalley Abbey had been hanged or when King Edward VI's men came and destroyed the stained glass windows and took away the statues? It must have been shocking. Of course, we can only guess. But we know that many of the rich Lancashire families remained Catholic. They protected priests who secretly came to celebrate the mass. Poor Pendle folk must also have clung to the old religion partly because it was what they knew well. In fact, their religion was probably a strange blend of early, pre-Christian practices and their simple understanding of what the Catholic faith was all about. They certainly would not have understood the Latin used in the services. So, they used their own versions of the prayers, almost as charms or spells to protect themselves. They punished with curses those who might harm them.

All of this suggests to us that their beliefs were a harmless mixture of religion, superstition and magic. The Pendle brood who were accused of witchcraft certainly fall within this category. But they did not always appear harmless to people living at the time.

Rich and powerful Protestants in Lancashire did not like the survival of Catholicism. They were afraid that the Catholics would, one day, rise up against all the changes and restore the Catholic Church. Some of their anxieties had nothing to do with religion. Many of these rich Lancashire families had done very well out of the dissolution of the monasteries. Henry had rewarded them for their support by either giving them land or selling it to them cheaply. They certainly did not want to risk having to give it back to the monasteries. This almost happened when the Catholic queen, Mary Tudor (Mary I) was on the throne (1553-1558).

So, it is against this background of poverty, hardship and religious upheaval that we must put the events of 1612. These are just some of the factors that we will need to consider when the time comes to arrive at a decision about the guilt or innocence of those accused of witchcraft.





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SueR
New Member


25 Posts
Posted - 05/09/2005 : 22:21
Donald, I think your analysis of the times in which the hangings took place is spot on but I am a little puzzled at your last sentence.  It has never occurred to me personally that they were guilty of "witchcraft" or even murder: just victims of superstition and human nature, which tends to seek to blame others for its own misfortune, even when there is no one to blame.


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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 06/09/2005 : 05:53
Keth Thomas 'Religion and the decline of Magic' has some interesting things to say about this.  Well worth reading.  His thesis is that magic was what people used to try to influence events otherwise out of their control.  Organised religions took the ideas and persecuted the opposition.  Technology is the modern magic.  This is the idiot's guide to the book, much more in there, well worth a read........


Stanley Challenger Graham




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BarrowfordJohn
Regular Member


706 Posts
Posted - 06/09/2005 : 12:49

Donald, this is a nicely concise observation upon one facet relating to an extremely complicated issue. Certainly many social problems revolved around the Papish social core - and utter contempt for the tenant class from the secular and monastic hierarchy - during the early modern period. This, to my mind, is being echoed today in many ways.

A couple of points of interest - there is much debate amongst etymologists as to the exact origin of the word 'witch'. The linguistic authority, James W  Bright, has it that the word comes from the Old English 'Wita' for wise-man or counsellor relating to 'witedom' for prophecy and 'witan' to know.

There is also a school of thought that has it that 'wicka' is Scandinavianised Saxon with the meaning of ' to bend or turn away' I have some sympathy with this as  local records from the 16th century relate that the term 'wicken' actually applies to willow groves and hedges - i think that this is where the name of Wiccan Clough above Admergill originates. There is also the consideration here of the willow wand.

The origin that I like most is the word 'weik' which was a Celtic word, from the base Indo-European, for magic within religion. The word could have been absorbed into the Saxon, as was common, and then bastardised with the suffix -ch when the Saxon Chroniclers wrote their records in Latin.

The practice of begging was lawful under licence from the magistrates department; I have read that Elizabeth Southern had such a licence but have seen no evidence for this.




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SueR
New Member


25 Posts
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 01:50
Stanley, the book sounds very interesting. It seems to me that a belief in something that cannot be proved or disproved, whether it be witches, ghosts, aliens, god(s) etc, is all too often used as a means of one person having power over another. At its most basic level, it says I know something you don't and that makes me better and therefore more powerful than you! I suspect that the Pendle 'witches', most of whom with the notable exception of Alice Nutter, were desperately poor, used every means to survive in life including taking advantage of the superstitions of the time. Sadly for them they did not see the danger of a little hocus pocus [is that how you spell it?!].

Religion uses the same premise with the added enticement of life everlasting, heaven or what you will, combined with the threat of eternal damnation. Again it is an exercise in control.

Pace, all believers!


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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 07/09/2005 : 06:41

I reckon you are on to it Sue.  When you look at religion and all the related sub-sets within the subject there is only one social explanation that fits all cases and that is people struggling for control through power whether it was the old widow brewing up potions for locals or the Pope in Rome.  I've always been fascinated by the overlap bbetween the old religions and belief systems and the advent of Christianity, particularly the Roman variety. 

Here's what I wrote in 'The Early History of Barlick (14)':  "Bede quotes from letters written by Pope Gregory, the originals of which still exist in Rome so we can be sure of their authenticity. On 17th June 601 Gregory wrote to the Abbot Mellitus who he was sending to join Augustine at Canterbury, later he became Bishop of London and third archbishop of Canterbury. In the letter Gregory gives clear instructions as to how existing pagan temples should be dealt with. They were not to be destroyed, the idols should be removed, altars erected and the whole edifice sprinkled with Holy Water. The slaughter of animals for sacrifice should be allowed but only as celebrations connected with the festivals of the church or saints days. The intention was to make as few changes as possible so that the Pagans would accept the new religion. Gregory specifically mentioned the practice of decorating the church with greenery and said that this should be allowed but again, as part of church festivals. When I first read this I immediately thought of the use of holly and mistletoe as Christmas decorations, both these were closely associated with Pagan rites. Think also of the practice of putting flowers in church and decorating the church with produce at Harvest Festivals. While I was in Germany last year I saw a church being decorated with boughs of greenery on the outside and was told it was part of the festival of Mary Himmelfart, that is Mary’s ascension to heaven."

I've always wondered whether the transformation of bread and wine into flesh and blood and the overtones of cannibalism are a direct steal from the old religions.  Eating another human being always struck me as a very un-religious thing to do.  Call me picky......  Closely related to this is the use of blood in religious imagery.  See the chapter on Methodist Hymns in 'The Making of the English Working Class' by E P Thompson.

Have a look at Thomas, you will love it......  One of the truly seminal history nooks as far as I am concerned.




Stanley Challenger Graham




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Randall
New Member


3 Posts
Posted - 26/11/2005 : 05:44

Happened to see a show about Samlesbury Hall tonight, and was interested to find it is quite close to where my family lived for over 700 years. This got me into searching a bit about Alice Nutter, wondering if she ever was there, and eventually I found this site.

Like so many, I too am a Nutter, (my grandmother's family.) My great aunt Jean Nutter Nelson who devoted her life to research of her family name Nutter, was able to trace our family to within a couple generations of Alice Nutter, the supposed "witch." My aunt spent many hours on planes flying back and forth to Burnley from the States, pouring through endless musty records, and photographing and visiting all the old lineages (people) and residences. Within this research, the result of over 30 years, she told me that the records available, to enable a trace back to Alice directly, was not possible. Something about incomplete records from Alice's time period. I do feel Alice Nutter is related to our family, as so many others likely do as well. This being that all Nutters are related, around the world, and all can be traced back to Lancashire, so I am told. The earliest records go back to Henry II if I remember right, and the Nutters were considered "foresters for the King." A common occupation in early times, basically to mean they managed  land owned by the crown. Not to say they were somehow underprivileged however, as we all know the "crown" held a majority of holdings, and the rest were held by royal relations. The Nutters have a slight connections with Towneley Hall (shirt tale, I am told).......more direct connection with Greenhead Manor, other residences are buried in files. We do have quite a nice coat of arms, with a Boar. Unfortunately Roughlee Hall, I am told was not the home of Alice Nutter. But as I have found in research, there is always something to local legend, so perhaps Roughlee does indeed play a role in Alice's history somehow, but what? You would think her address would be notated somewhere in the inquisition paperwork?   

It is in regard to this research that I have been led to believe that the early Nutters were devout Catholics. No surprise really. It is thought in our family that Alice was likely attending a secret Catholic ceremony, when she was implicated. Her position was not akin to the other villagers tried,  Alice as we know belonged to a family of good standing and moderate wealth. (if she had great wealth, her home would not be such a mystery) I firmly feel she was not a "witch," but rather simply a woman entrapped in a situation where if she confessed her real mission, she would implicate her other secret church friends. As I have said being a Catholic was considered a serious offense, and devout people did not endanger other members. This is why she was supposedly the only woman "witch" ever condemed that never confessed anything. She was a noble woman, who suffered great anquish at the hands of some very misguided people. It is obvious by the different circumstances of Alice in regard to the trial, that she was not a "witch." Don't forget it is possible that like many wealthy families, the Nutter family may have had certain records destroyed in regard to the matter, at the time. There would have been great embarrassment and a loss of position with the family, over such a monumental event. The family certainly appears to have been able to extricate Alice from the situation, but why was it not done......another mystery that surely will never be solved.  

We have two other proud and special souls in our family too: Robert and John Nutter. They so wanted to be a part of the church, which was "illegal" at the time, that they traveled to France where they became priests. However, as soon as they returned to their beloved England, they were captured....... tried........ drawn and quartered, in Hyde Park. Nice huh?? Martyrs are no strangers within our family tree. Yes, those were trying times. But I am proud of those that showed conviction, loyalty, and devotion to their beliefs.

There is such romance and interest by people in witches of old, and I hope to not take away from such yarns.  But in my opinion, Alice simply was not a witch, our family seems to be much more peppered with staunch religious martyrs, not practitioners of paganism. I even take exception to the word "witch," which ignorant people have applied to those neighbors and friends that may have been different. Such sad times, when those that are interested in natural healing, and herbs, etc., are said to be witches. But not unlike today's society when we call people all sorts of other "names." I guess society never changes.

So..........just my opinion out of many, I really enjoyed the discussion in this forum on this topic, and am pleased there is interest. It might be of interest to state I am not Catholic, but more akin to New Age in religion. Interesting how things change through the generations................... 

Randall, Sedona AZ USA



Edited by - Randall on 26 November 2005 05:50:45

Edited by - Randall on 26 November 2005 19:36:24


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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 26/11/2005 : 06:09
Randall, we are still working on Malkin Tower.......  As for the origin of the name, there is a possibility you may be wrong if you assume that all Nutters came from Lancashire.  One generally accepted root for the name is 'neatherd', these were the men who patrolled the boundaries of the hunting 'forest' and turned any of the royal deer back which were straying.  In this case the forest was Blackburnshire but there were many others all over England and a good possibbility of others who took the occupational 'neatherd' as a surname.  Of course, all these did not necessarily corrupt to Nutter, there could be variations.


Stanley Challenger Graham




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BarrowfordJohn
Regular Member


706 Posts
Posted - 26/11/2005 : 12:31

Randall, welcome to the site. Further to Stanley's reply - I would be very interested to attempt to tie-in your knowledge of the Nutter family to the stuff I have been researching on this subject over the past couple of years. Any information you care to post would be appreciated and of importance to our local history.

I agree with your sentiments on the whole affair, there is, however, more to the story than the basic religious persecution, politics and greed also played a major part.

Alice Nutter came from a gentry family in Holme. near Cliviger (Burnley) and married Richard Nutter of Crow Trees Farm in Roughlee. Richard's father was a yeoman farmer at Crow Trees, the only connection the family had with Roughlee Old Hall was that Richard, father, Miles Nutter, along with others, surrendered a plot of land to the Smith family (part of the Smith & Nephew cotton firm) in the 16th c upon which they built Roughlee Old Hall. The Smiths & Hartleys occupied the Hall.

Richard Nutter (d 1584) and Alice inherited the Crow Trees lands when his father died (I have Alice Nutter's dowry record on file). Alice's son, Miles, inherited when she was executed. Local folklore has it that he died a lingering death, this was seen as just retribution for the fact that he allowed his mother to be prosecuted in order to obtain her lands. Mile's wife was implicated in the 'Robinson' witch trials of 1633.

Other children Richard=Alice Nutter were: John (lived at Admergill): James: Richard and Elizabeth. Miles married Anne Clarke in 1602 at Newchurch, he appears to have been something of a waster as the property is declining rapidly by the 1620s.There was no legitimate issue from this marriage but Miles had 2 illegitimate children - Ellen by a Robinson and Henry by a Hartley . It appears that Mile's siblings have moved from the area by the 1620s.

Miles died in 1633, just when his wife was being accused of being a witch by a lad called Robinson - Miles illegit dtr was by a Robinson - she also married a Robinson, the Nutters inherited Dam Head at Roughlee through  this marriage: this gets more and more complicated, yet another inheritance in tandem with 'witchcraft'. Dam Head remains as a 17th c farmhouse where Alice Nutters grandaughter Ellen lived.

Miles's 2 Illegit. children inherited what remained of his estate, no mention in his will of any of the other Nutter clan - something odd had happened here. No apparent issue from these 2 offspring so the Nutter's Roughlee estate passes sideways to the more distant relatives of the Nutters of  Pendle Waterside (now Quaker Bridge, Brierfield). This is probably where the Towneley connection originates as Ellis Nutter of Waterside married a Townleley of Barnside (originally the Towneley Hall family).

As far as I am aware Ellis was the father of the Blessed John Nutter, the Catholic martyr (d 1584) and Robert Nutter (1557-1600) who was beatified November 22nd 1987. The Queen's spies reported that Robert had become a highly effective missionary who concentrated on the South Midlands, London and the South Coast. Robert was arrested in 1584 but charges of treason could not be proved. He was banished from the land and stayed in Rheims, not for long though, he returned to England and was quickly arrested, eventually he was imprisoned in Wisbech, Cambridge for a number of years. Here he enlisted in the St. Dominic's order of Preachers and, in 1600, escaped from the prison. Described as ' of sturdy body but even more sturdy of soul' Robert tokk the aliases of Royle and and Askew and headed north. He was quickly re-arrested and sent to Lancaster Gaol, convicted of being a priest under the Act of 1585 and 'endured death with great courage, resolution and fortitude' in July 1600. A hymn was written to celebrate Robert, this was a lengthy piece called "Nutter's bould constancie."

The Nutters did live at Greenhead and were connected to the Shuttleworths of Gawthorp Hall. They were also amongst the very first recorded vaccary keepers of Pendle Forest when it was turned over to farming (12-13thc). They were foresters, constables and greaves of the forest over the centuries, the Nutters at the hamlet of Pendle waterside were particularly large land owners.

Tracing the roots of this family is notoriously difficult, no one has ever proved a link directly to Richard Nutter (Alice is another story) - throw into the equation that the family also had a heavy involvement with the Robinsons and Hartleys it would take more than one book to even illustrate a basic family tree! 

Sources: "Martyrs of the Diocese of Lancaste"r: Mullett & Warren and "Roughlee Hall - Fact and Fiction" Gladys Whittaker and the Clitheroe Court Rolls - Farrer.



Edited by - BarrowfordJohn on 26 November 2005 14:37:12


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Randall
New Member


3 Posts
Posted - 26/11/2005 : 19:28

WOW!!

Thank you both, John and Stanley, for your wonderful responses.

I feel quite out of my league on all this, and probably shouldn't have posted so many vague details. I have not been in the fray of the information for 30 years, and all the files my aunt shared with me are packed away in storage. The rest is in my foggy memory, which is full of dusty files and bad lighting! LOL! My aunt herself died several years ago and her information rests now with her elderly husband, and family. In answer to a few points though, it is obvious I have forgotten all the specific details of her research. I just remember the basic gist of what she mentioned to me from time to time. I do know she was always rather hurt that in spite of all her research and travels, that so few in the family showed any interest, except myself. Her husband who was quite high up in United Airlines, made it possible for her to travel back and forth to Burnley through the years on a free pass, with no regard to cost. Certainly an asset when one has such a hobby.

 

It certainly was a misstatement for me to say all Nutters originated in Lancashire, and I hope to not mislead on that aspect, but more appropriately it would be better to say that the majority, can be traced in general, back to that area.

.

The other information you posted John, was amazing! I wish my Aunt and you could have connected, she also would be thrilled at your data. Seems you are the real authority on Alice! I recognized much of the information you related, so it is obvious you and my Aunt Jean have uncovered similar records. But with no records at my fingertips, and no current info on the subject for years, I am quite rusty on my details, as you surmised. I was very interested to hear the lineage as you had found it. My Aunt Jean did tell me once that she was able to make more breakthroughs after they opened the records at Lancaster Castle? Something about previous records never having been available before? Either way I so wish she was alive to partake of the internet age, you all have such wonderful information about our past, (all of us that came from that region) and I commend you all! My aunt would be so excited if she could have shared information. I have located your website, and will go through it as I have time….terrific!Not that this means much to many out there, that have their own proud heritage, but my own lineage and connection with the area is as follows: (in condensed form)

Grandmother and sister Virginia and Jean Nutter, and others, born in Gibbon Nebraska,

Parents: John Nutter born Gloucester, N.J. 1856 wife Jeannie Reinholdson

Parents : William Nutter born 1830 New Church in Pendle and wife Dinah Ingham born Old Laund Booth New Church in Pendle

Parents: John Nutter born 1795 New Church and Betty Knowles born 1795 Whitehough New Church

Parents: John Nutter born 1768 and Grace Wildman 1772, (remarried to George Hayworth)

Parents: Robert Nutter

I had to call my dad to get the above facts, but think my records go back much farther and are much more complete. This is the best I can do for now, without digging through storage. I appreciate the comments and effort to post them. Good luck on the research and it has been a pleasure to meet you all!

Happy Holidays from Sedona Arizona!

Randall author of the Helen and Jack Frye Story

http://www.sedonalegendhelenfrye.com

 



Edited by - Randall on 26 November 2005 19:31:13


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BarrowfordJohn
Regular Member


706 Posts
Posted - 27/11/2005 : 11:45

Thanks for that, Randall. Much of the information on this family is from the 1980 work of Gladys Whittaker, a member of the Nelson Local History Society.

I hope that your aunt's hard-earned information ends up in your hands eventually, it would be a great shame for it to go to someone who is not interested - this has been the fate of many family records over the years. It would be nice to think that you could get back to us with some of the records sometime in the future. Stanley lodges the information on this site periodically with the Clitheroe Castle archives thus preserving it - if you wished to post any of the records at any time you would be assured that they will have found a good home!

 




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Randall
New Member


3 Posts
Posted - 27/11/2005 : 16:27

John:

Thanks for the note............I think you all have done an amazing job achiving so much region history! Interesting coincidence that my aunt's name was Jean Nelson. Either way, I think I will have access to the files if I can ever get up to Denver to see my Uncle. I have done extensive research into the TWA story, and have wanted to work with my Uncle in regard to the United Airlines history.

My aunt Jean had such passion in regard to the Nutter history, and never missed an opportunity to pour over new records. I doubt that there is anything she had that you all don't have, but I will keep you in mind when I eventually have access to more details. It is wonderful that people are showing an interest in the dusty, not always glamorous, history of Lancashire peoples! Terrific! 

I have since childhood been interested in this Malkin Tower, I realize that people no longer know the actual location. But I always thought it sounded so mysterious. What was it, an old castle tower, something from the 1200's ?? A mystery, and interesting to be sure, what was it's history?? That I hope to learn someday.  

 



Edited by - Randall on 27 November 2005 16:34:04


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SueR
New Member


25 Posts
Posted - 27/11/2005 : 17:49


quote:
Randall wrote:

WOW!!

Thank you both, John and Stanley, for your wonderful responses.

I feel quite out of my league on all this, and probably shouldn't have posted so many vague details. I have not been in the fray of the information for 30 years, and all the files my aunt shared with me are packed away in storage. The rest is in my foggy memory, which is full of dusty files and bad lighting! LOL! My aunt herself died several years ago and her information rests now with her elderly husband, and family. In answer to a few points though, it is obvious I have forgotten all the specific details of her research. I just remember the basic gist of what she mentioned to me from time to time. I do know she was always rather hurt that in spite of all her research and travels, that so few in the family showed any interest, except myself. Her husband who was quite high up in United Airlines, made it possible for her to travel back and forth to Burnley through the years on a free pass, with no regard to cost. Certainly an asset when one has such a hobby.

 

It certainly was a misstatement for me to say all Nutters originated in Lancashire, and I hope to not mislead on that aspect, but more appropriately it would be better to say that the majority, can be traced in general, back to that area.

.

The other information you posted John, was amazing! I wish my Aunt and you could have connected, she also would be thrilled at your data. Seems you are the real authority on Alice! I recognized much of the information you related, so it is obvious you and my Aunt Jean have uncovered similar records. But with no records at my fingertips, and no current info on the subject for years, I am quite rusty on my details, as you surmised. I was very interested to hear the lineage as you had found it. My Aunt Jean did tell me once that she was able to make more breakthroughs after they opened the records at Lancaster Castle? Something about previous records never having been available before? Either way I so wish she was alive to partake of the internet age, you all have such wonderful information about our past, (all of us that came from that region) and I commend you all! My aunt would be so excited if she could have shared information. I have located your website, and will go through it as I have time….terrific!Not that this means much to many out there, that have their own proud heritage, but my own lineage and connection with the area is as follows: (in condensed form)

Grandmother and sister Virginia and Jean Nutter, and others, born in Gibbon Nebraska,

Parents: John Nutter born Gloucester, N.J. 1856 wife Jeannie Reinholdson

Parents : William Nutter born 1830 New Church in Pendle and wife Dinah Ingham born Old Laund Booth New Church in Pendle

Parents: John Nutter born 1795 New Church and Betty Knowles born 1795 Whitehough New Church

Parents: John Nutter born 1768 and Grace Wildman 1772, (remarried to George Hayworth)

Parents: Robert Nutter

I had to call my dad to get the above facts, but think my records go back much farther and are much more complete. This is the best I can do for now, without digging through storage. I appreciate the comments and effort to post them. Good luck on the research and it has been a pleasure to meet you all!

Happy Holidays from Sedona Arizona!

Randall author of the Helen and Jack Frye Story

http://www.sedonalegendhelenfrye.com

 



Edited by - Randall on 26 November 2005 19:31:13




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