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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted -  14/11/2010  :  06:41
New version to make loading easier'

Old topic is HERE


Stanley Challenger Graham




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stanley at barnoldswick.freeserve.co.uk
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frankwilk
Senior Member


3975 Posts
Posted - 24/01/2011 : 09:38
That's how I heard it explained as well.



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belle
VIP Member


6502 Posts
Posted - 24/01/2011 : 09:38
Do you think "Clinker" is onoematapeic (or however it's spelt!)


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frankwilk
Senior Member


3975 Posts
Posted - 24/01/2011 : 09:42
Nah it's what falls off the back of chain grate boilers, or I have heard it described as, I better leave that.



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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 25/01/2011 : 07:03
Belle. the root of the word for clinching the nails is that as well and could easily be a reinforcement for the use of the word clinker in that context. Word origins are far more complicated than simple derivations and we do well to remember that. Think about a word like 'ring' as in 'ringing a bell'. It actually sounds like the noise a bell makes. Webster give origin as ME ringen, OE hringhan, ON hringjha. German ringen. Who is to say that all these weren't onomatopaeic? Think of the word for mother. mom. mum mutti. mere etc. Often thought to be based on the first sounds a baby makes.


Stanley Challenger Graham




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belle
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6502 Posts
Posted - 25/01/2011 : 08:40
I think it's because we use the term "clink" for the sound of glassware touching briefly and that is not unlike the sound of "clinkers".


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catgate
Senior Member


1764 Posts
Posted - 25/01/2011 : 10:58
I suppose prisoners could be called clinkers.


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belle
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6502 Posts
Posted - 25/01/2011 : 11:06
yes, but they weren't..it's not a rule that has to be applied universally...it's colloquialism..


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Bradders
Senior Member


1880 Posts
Posted - 25/01/2011 : 13:24
I have a recollection of my Dad explaining "gone for a Burton" in Brewery /beer terms  ....Burton-on-Trent  or the Burtonwood  brewery ?

Also wasn't there an engine refurbishment company called Burtonwood ?


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belle
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6502 Posts
Posted - 25/01/2011 : 14:37
Yes that's the one i heard Bradders which is why this new explanation intriued me.


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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 26/01/2011 : 04:14
Brewer; Phrase and Fable thinks it originated in the RAF. Burton on Trent ales were famous and often ordered as 'A Burton' so you get the idea of Burton = drink. Drink was slang for the sea so by association 'going for a burton' could mean crashed in the sea. Probably some sort of mixture of the two. Sounds plausible to me.

Burtonwood in Lancashire was the location of one of the biggest US air bases in WW2.


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marilyn
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5007 Posts
Posted - 26/01/2011 : 09:16
I thought klinker referred to bricks that are well fired.
(and were a modern day referral to constipation)


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tripps
Senior Member


1404 Posts
Posted - 26/01/2011 : 11:04
I don't think anyone ever ordered "a Burton" in a pub.  (Can you get treatment for continual scepticism on the NHS?).  Brewed in the town were Bass, Ind Coop and Allsop, Worthington,  Whitbread, which were all marketed under their brand name.  The ony brewery with Burton in the name seems to be The Burton Brewery which only dates back to 1982. Don't forget - a few days ago it was said on here  that the phrase referred to going for  a (Montague) Burton demob suit! 
I guess we are still in "don't know" territory. There must be an origin somewhere - who knows?


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catgate
Senior Member


1764 Posts
Posted - 26/01/2011 : 11:56


quote:
tripps wrote:
Don't forget - a few days ago it was said on here  that the phrase referred to going for  a (Montague) Burton demob suit! 

I think you may find that this has a more to do with "The full Monty" than airmen being shot down into the drink.


Every silver lining has a cloud.


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tripps
Senior Member


1404 Posts
Posted - 26/01/2011 : 13:59
Good to see you paynig attention, but Belle started the current theme with -

"Going for a Burton" and the "full Monty" attributing both to the Leeds Clothier Montague Burton....the first being a reference to a de mob suit, so when you left the forces you "went for a Burton" and the second meaning a suit with all the trimmings"

As I said before - either or both may,  or may not be true.  My money is on both false.


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catgate
Senior Member


1764 Posts
Posted - 26/01/2011 : 14:56
I always favoured Henry Price's "50 shilling tailor" (John Collier) .  Burtons were too upmarket for me.


Every silver lining has a cloud.


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