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Tizer
VIP Member


5150 Posts
Posted -  21/12/2007  :  11:56
I have uploaded my first picture to the Barlick site I hope to be able to add it in this thread if/when it gets approval from Doc. It is a postcard from the 1940s entitled Winged Heroes and showing Hawker Hurricanes. (The picture is in the next post if you are on page 1 of the thread; if you are on another page you need to go back tp page 1 to see it.)

Please feel free to add your own stories, pictures or comments regarding everything to do with aeroplanes and their pilots, both past and present.

Edited by - Tizer on 11/11/2010 15:11:42


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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 26/08/2010 : 08:14
Peter, I'm no expert on aircraft but I think 'handed engines refers to the direction of rotation, having one clockwise and one counter clockwise balanced any tendency to roll one way or another due to both rotating the same way. That's why they fitted contra-rotating props on some engines, another way round the same problem. Also why  a Chinook doesn't need a tail rotor, the rotors contra-rotate and balance the forces.


Stanley Challenger Graham




Barlick View
stanley at barnoldswick.freeserve.co.uk Go to Top of Page
Tizer
VIP Member


5150 Posts
Posted - 26/08/2010 : 10:43
Ian, the Spitfire model and photos are amazing - to use his own words, "The degree of detail is probably obsessive"!

Stanley, I learn something everyday, as they say - but especially on OGFB, thanks. It's information like this that could get young people, women as well as men, interested in being engineers.


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Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 27/08/2010 : 04:47
I seem to remember reading somewhere that many single engine fighters had varying degrees of tendency to veer off course especially when taking off. As engines became more powerful this became a big problem.


Stanley Challenger Graham




Barlick View
stanley at barnoldswick.freeserve.co.uk Go to Top of Page
jgb7573
New Member


44 Posts
Posted - 27/08/2010 : 09:11
I believe that the the old radial engines, where the whole cylinder assembly rotated with the prop on a fixed crankshaft, would turn rather better in one direction than in the other. The effect (gyroscopic?) caused by a heavy lump rotating at speed at the front of the plane was very marked.


JohnB,

Found that horn - gorn! Go to Top of Page
frankwilk
Senior Member


3975 Posts
Posted - 27/08/2010 : 21:30
http://www.condor49ers.org.uk/gannet.htm

remebered the gannet had two props



Frank Wilkinson       Once Navy Always Navy Go to Top of Page
Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 28/08/2010 : 07:01
John, it always amazed me that the concept of the radial engine persisted for so long. I was once told that the popularity of the flat four configuration of the Teledyne Continental engines was due to the opposed pistons cancelling vibrations out. Tens of thousands of these still in use in fixed wing aircraft and helicopters. I became quite familar with these engines when helping my daughter to investigate her husband's death. (By the way, it's now public knowledge that Janet has won her case for compensation. Seven years to the day after the crash. Gott sei dank! and sod the lawyers.)


Stanley Challenger Graham




Barlick View
stanley at barnoldswick.freeserve.co.uk Go to Top of Page
Tizer
VIP Member


5150 Posts
Posted - 28/08/2010 : 11:07
Would the persistence of the radial engine in early military aircraft be related to the use of guns firing through the propeller boss?

"Opposed pistons cancelling vibrations out" was Alfa Romeo's argument for the flat four engine used in the Alfa Sud (as well as low centre of gravity).

Frank, great Gannet story! Here are Gannets and Sea Hawks in unusual markings...click here


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thomo
Barlick Born Old Salt


2021 Posts
Posted - 28/08/2010 : 11:36
The Spitfire was possibly one of the worst aircraft to handle on the ground due mainly to the combination of the wheel arrangement and the effect of the prop in coarse pitch, some of the later Spitfires fitted with Griffon engines had "Contra Rotating Props" one of the BBMF aircraft is as such, as is one of those owned by Rolls Royce. The Fairey Gannet was built with this arrangement and unlike the Earlier Spitfires was able to cope well with the deck landing and taking off from carriers. Some of the later "Sea Hurricanes" also had contra rotating props.


thomo Go to Top of Page
thomo
Barlick Born Old Salt


2021 Posts
Posted - 29/08/2010 : 13:48
I have just been looking at a site which contains information about the "Stuka" one of of WW2s terrible manifestations, The reason for this is that I wanted to know what engines they had as the one on my FS sounds like a Cessna, And what a surprise, the originals were powered by Rolls Royce engines, for reasons that soon became obvious they were then fitted with BMW engines!!!


thomo Go to Top of Page
Tizer
VIP Member


5150 Posts
Posted - 29/08/2010 : 17:16
It's surprising how many German aircraft did start out with British engines - and some of them ended up with British again after the war in their second career with other air forces!


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panbiker
Senior Member


2301 Posts
Posted - 30/08/2010 : 11:40
More Merlins than you could shake the preverbial stick at yesterday and had "up close" experience of every aircraft in the BBMF flight. Thought I was in heaven. Report and pictures to follow....... got quite a lot!


Ian Go to Top of Page
panbiker
Senior Member


2301 Posts
Posted - 30/08/2010 : 23:07
Right here we go .... I noticed last week on The BBMF website that they were having an "open hangar" weekend at the Conningsby base of the flight. The hangar is normaly open to the public but only during the week. I had been promising myself a trip here for some time and never got round to it so I made plans for a trip out on the motorbike for Saturday or Sunday. I thought Sunday would be the best day as the flying shedule had the Dakota and on of the Spitfires leaving from Conningsby at 14.00 and 14.20 for short flypast sorties and then returning about an hour later. An ideal day to see some in flight and visit the hangar as well.

Weather was not too kind on the way down, I set of at about 10am on Sunday morning and the rain followed me all the way to Doncaster on the A1. I stopped for a brew while the worst of it passed. I left the A1 just above Sleaford with my reserve fuel indicator flashing on the bike. I had to spend about 40 minutes around Sleaford looking for a petrol station that was open on Sunday. Consequently the downward journey took me about an hour more than it should have.  It was very windy on the bike and quite hairy in places. especially after leaving Sleaford for Skegness on route for Conningsby. I arrived at about 1.30pm



After parking the bike up I made my way over the road. There were about 20  people waiting outside the perimiter fence with cameras at the ready for any activity from the hangar. There is a notice board that you can see through the fence that gives the weeks planned flights, Date, Departure Time, Aircraft, Flight Duration and Landing Time. The Dakota and Spitfire were on the list for the day. It was very windy with heavy gusts and I was not surprised when 2.0pm came and went without the hangar doors opening. People started to drift off so I made my way to the visitors centre which is in a building to the rear of the BBMF hangar.



The visitor Centre has a number of exhibits depicting the aircraft of the BBMF flight, the story of the Battle of Britain and one or two hands on exhibits - you can have a go with a radio receiver and they have a flight simulator running on a PC that you can fly a bombing run on. There is a shop section selling memorabila. It was interesting to note that you can get  Haynes manuals for the Spitfire, Hurricane, Lancaster and Dakota. I think that some of the technical guys that work on the BBMF flight aircraft have contributed to these. You can only go round the hangar with a guide, the place was quite busy so I qued for a short while and bought my ticket for the Green tour which would be at about 3.15pm. The tour costs £5.00 and lasts approximately 1 hour. Timings are not exact as the tours vary I suppose depending on the number of questions the guides have to answer. They take about 10 or 12 people on each tour and they start about 20 minutes apart. MIne was called at 3.20pm and we duly assembled and were escorted across to the hangar.

There is a cordoned off walkway down one side of the hangar. On entering, I could not believe my eyes. All the chick's bar 1 were at home! Dakota at one end of the Hangar, Lancaster at the other about 100 yards away, lining each side Spitfires and Hurricanes. 4 Spitfires and 2 Hurricanes to be exact with a further Spitfire as work in progress. A Chipmunk trainer completes the lineup in the bottom corner of the hangar. When our tour got to the bottom of the hangar our guide let me and a couple more guys over the barrier for a closer look. How good can this get!

I will post the pictures according to each aircraft with a few notes for each.

The full history of each of these machines can be found on the BBMF website here:

 http://www.raf.mod.uk/bbmf/theaircraft/index.cfm

Spitfire AB910 (Mk Vb)

This is the aircraft that took off during the war with a WAAF sat on the tail! read the full story on the BBMF website.



 



Spitfire MK356 (Mk LFIXe)

Chequered history this one with two belly landings and complete wheel loss on takeoff on one sortie, pilot completed mission and belly landed the aircraft for the third time on return. Was fully rebuilt in 1993 after 53 years as static airframe and gate guardian. Returned to service with BBMF fully refurbished in 1997.



Spitfire PS915 (Mk PRXIX)

This aircraft was built just after the end of the war in June 1945 and flew the last operational sortie of any Spitfire in 1954. This was  essentially the end of the piston era of flight in the RAF. Five blade prop and Griffon engined.

 

 



Spitfire P7350 (Mk IIa)
Hurricane LF363 (Mk IIc)

Hurricane LF363 is beleived to be the last to enter service with the RAF. It has seen continuous service with the RAF from 1944 to 1991 when it crashed. It has since been completely re-built and re-joined the BBMF in 1998

 

 



Spitfire - Work in Progress

Here is one in the process of refurbishment. No official designation yet. It will be re-registered when flight ready and approved.



 Port side engine bay



 Front view of merlin showing air scoop



 Starboard side view of merlin



Hurricane PZ865 (Mk IIc)

This is the last Hurricane ever built and currently carries the livery of "Night Reaper" a night fighter fitted with 4 x Cannon. See the history on the BBMF website.

 



 



 



AVRO Lancaster PA474

 Rear port side view



 Elevator port side



 Upper Gun Turret



Bomb Bay showing bomb retaining gear

 

 The red retaing gear is for larger the larger odinance.

There is no access to the bomb bay from above except for a small access hatch. Ordinace is loaded from below and is electrically released by the bombadier.

When the Lancaster is tasked with the remembrance poppy drop over London, it takes a week to load the bomb bay with over a million poppies. They have to close the bomb bay doors and feed all the paper poppies in through the small access hatch. they use a blower to distribute them the full length of the bomb bay. The aircraft technicians share the duty to load the bomb bay.



 Port side Nose art - "Phantom of the Ruhr"



 Starboard side "City of Lincoln"



 Front Starboard showing inboard port and Starboard engines and props, Upper Front Gun Turret, Bomb Aimers sighting position in the nose and massive bomb bay. The covers on the tyres are to protect from oil spills.



Douglas C47 (DC3) Dakota ZA947

 This is the aircraft that we had at our 40's event at Barlick. It is now fitted with original jump seats in the back.



 Rear Starboard view.

 

We are back at the bottom of the hangar now. Our tour lasted about an hour and fifteen minutes. Best five quid I have spent for a long time. Good day out - recommended.


Ian Go to Top of Page
Stanley
Local Historian & Old Fart


36804 Posts
Posted - 31/08/2010 : 07:10
Good pics, a pleasure to look through them.


Stanley Challenger Graham




Barlick View
stanley at barnoldswick.freeserve.co.uk Go to Top of Page
Tizer
VIP Member


5150 Posts
Posted - 31/08/2010 : 10:14
Terrific set of photos Ian and thanks for making all the effort to submit them to OGFB - and to put them in a thread too. Their collection looks even better than the collection of Airfix kits I had as a child!

I notice the Spitfire in progress has clipped wing tips - was that for better low-level flying?

I'll have to show my dad the pics of the Lancaster bomb bay. He spent a lot of time loading them up with bombs.

Edited by - Tizer on 31/08/2010 20:18:40


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thomo
Barlick Born Old Salt


2021 Posts
Posted - 31/08/2010 : 13:03
You lucky man Ian, well done and many thanks for the insight into the BBMF, I can almost smell the glycol and dope. I am toying with the idea of starting a new topic about aviation in general and my life long interest, it would not be fair to clutter up Winged Heroes with other stuff as it is already a great topic, many thanks Tiz and Ian.


thomo Go to Top of Page
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